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Wireless => Competitive Battling => Topic started by: Scarlet Spider on June 10, 2011, 09:27:36 am



Title: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on June 10, 2011, 09:27:36 am
There are Rules that people use in Competitive Battling against other people in order to make it a fair game.  There are two types of rules.  One of them are the Clauses, which are specific rules set to make things fair in battle.  Another is the Tier List which seperate Pokémon into different tiers based on usage or power.  All Pokémon from a higher tier is thus banned from a lower tier.  This topic will have the Clauses and Tiers listed.

Clauses:

Standard Clauses:
Standard Clauses are Rules that are enforced in every match in every tier that you battle in.  Breaking one of these clauses results in disqualification.  These Clauses are standard:

Species Clause
This clause is simple.  It just means No Doubles of Pokemon.  So you can't have more than 1 of the same Pokemon.  People who use things like two Tyranitars in battle, have to put 1 of them away for battles with the Species Clause in effect.

Sleep Clause
This clause means that you can not put more than one of your opponent's Pokémon to sleep using a move like Spore or Hypnosis.  If you want to put one of their Pokémon to sleep, then they have to have nothing else asleep, otherwise you will have to wait for one of their Pokémon to wake up.  This does not count on self-inflicted sleep via the move Rest.  A Pokémon can be asleep via Rest and not count towards this clause.

1hitKO Clause
Do you want to use your powerful moves like Sheer Cold, Horn Drill etc?  They are 1hitKO moves, which happen to be banned battles with this clause in effect. So don't teach your Pokemon these moves, because that would waste a space in your Pokemon's moveset, when you enter battles with this clause in effect.  The 1 hit KO moves are Sheer Cold, Fissure, Horn Drill and Guillotine.

Evasion Clause
The moves Double Team and Minimize are not allowed in battles because they allow Pokemon to evade being hit and have an overpowered luck element.  Currently the held items Brightpowder and Lax Incense are banned too as they increase evasion slightly.

Moody Clause
Certain Pokémon may have the ability Moody, so they will not be allowed in battle.  Moody's luck element brings a possible overpowered and unfair aspect to the game and could allow them to sweep the opponent or even evade moves easily.


Non Standard Clauses:
These Clauses could be enforced in a battle but they are not standard, so both players must agree before using one of these clauses in a battle.

Item Clause
No doubles of Items are allowed.  An example is that a lot of people use more than one Leftovers on their team, but that isn't allowed.  So remember to not have any doubles of items when the Item Clause is on in a match.  Official Nintendo tournaments usually have this clause enabled.

Status Clause
This clause means that you are not allowed to inflict doubles of a status effect like Burn, Poison, etc.  Self inflicted status effects caused by things like the Toxic Orb do not count towards this.  Also side effects of moves like Ember, Water Pulse, Ice Beam etc; do not count either as they are side effects of damaging moves which just happen to enflict the Status Condition.

Freeze Clause
This is almost exactly the same as the Sleep Clause but instead it's Freeze.  So freezing the opponent more than once is banned, but self inflicts get round it.  However this clause makes no sense since the only way to inflict freeze is via an accidental side affect via a move like Ice Beam, so noone should use this clause.

Self-KO Clause
The self sacrificing moves Explosion and SelfDestruct cannot be used when both you and your opponent only have 1 Pokemon left each.  Perish Song, Final Gambit and any other saccrifing moves that could destroy both Pokémon are banned at this point too when the clause is in effect.

Hax Item Clause
Items which require luck to use are banned in battles with this clause in effect.  These are the Brightpowder, Quick Claw, Focus Band and King's Rock.  Also a few of the Incense items have a lack aspect too.



Tiers:

The Pokémon Game is divided up into Tiers.  Most Tiers have a metagame in which Pokémon from the tier and below the tier are allowed.  Anything above is banned.

It goes like this:
Uber Tier (http://ludicom.smfforfree.com/index.php/topic,850.msg21951.html#msg21951)- Banlist from OU, Metagame where no Pokémon are banned
OU Tier (http://ludicom.smfforfree.com/index.php/topic,850.msg21950.html#msg21950)- OverUsed Tier, Standard Metagame where Ubers are banned, OU and below are allowed
BL Tier (http://ludicom.smfforfree.com/index.php/topic,850.msg21954.html#msg21954)- BorderLine Tier.  It is NOT a metagame, it is just a banlist from the UU Tier
UU Tier (http://ludicom.smfforfree.com/index.php/topic,850.msg21954.html#msg21954)- UnderUsed Tier. It is a Metagame which bans BL, OU and Uber Pokémon.
RU Tier- RarelyUsed Tier.  It bans Pokémon from all above tiers.
NU Tier- NeverUsed Tier.  It bans Pokémon from all above tiers.
- note that RU and NU will have banlists of their own but they do not have at the moment -

Little Cup- A Metagame which uses Lv5 Pokémon Bottom Stages.  It has a banlist of its own.


Title: The OU Tier
Post by: Scarlet Spider on June 10, 2011, 09:32:11 am
OU Tier

(http://oi54.tinypic.com/33joc2d.jpg)

OU stands for OverUsed and it is the Standard Metagame that most people play.  The OU Tier allows all Pokémon that are in OU and below.  All Pokémon that are above the OU Tier are banned.  The only Pokémon above OU are Pokémon in the Uber Tier, who are there for being too powerful for OU's metagame.  OU is determined by usage so the top used Pokémon are deemed OU.

The List Currently Includes:

(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/9/9e/598MS.png) Ferrothorn (http://www.smogon.com/bw/pokemon/ferrothorn)
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/0f/248MS.png) Tyranitar (http://www.smogon.com/bw/pokemon/tyranitar)
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/f2/212MS.png) Scizor (http://www.smogon.com/bw/pokemon/scizor)
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/a/ad/472MS.png) Gliscor
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/a/a4/381MS.png) Latios (http://www.smogon.com/bw/pokemon/latios)
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/7/71/530MS.png) Excadrill
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/7/77/579MS.png) Reuniclus
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/c/cf/485MS.png) Heatran
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/54/479WMS.png) Rotom (Wash Forme)
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/8b/534MS.png) Conkeldurr
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/9/9e/385MS.png) Jirachi
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/e9/186MS.png) Politoad
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/c/cc/149MS.png) Dragonite
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/b4/642MS.png) Thundurus
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/a/a4/094MS.png) Gengar
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/7/71/593MS.png) Jellicent
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/c/c9/227MS.png) Skarmory
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/7/78/637MS.png) Volcarona
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/55/121MS.png) Starmie
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/a/a0/130MS.png) Gyrados
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/83/635MS.png) Hydreigon
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/5f/205MS.png) Forretress
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/f8/242MS.png) Blissey
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/f5/392MS.png) Infernape
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/10/038MS.png) Ninetales
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/be/134MS.png) Vaporeon
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/8c/373MS.png) Salamence
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/ed/286MS.png) Breloom
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/3/39/609MS.png) Chandelure
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/a/a3/560MS.png) Scrafty
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/fc/073MS.png) Tentacruel
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/2/2d/376MS.png) Metagross
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/5d/639MS.png) Terrakion
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/a/a6/260MS.png) Swampert
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/5d/612MS.png) Haxorus
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/be/448MS.png) Lucario
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/bc/091MS.png) Cloyster
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/57/450MS.png) Hippowdon
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/2/26/462MS.png) Magnezone
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/fa/386SMS.png) Deoxys (Speed Forme)
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/1e/068MS.png) Machamp
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/a/a4/645MS.png) Landorus
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/1c/547MS.png) Whimsicott
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/84/380MS.png) Latias
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/0c/437MS.png) Bronzong
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/e4/620MS.png) Mienshao
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/52/555MS.png) Darmanitan
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/f9/454MS.png) Toxicroak
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/6/60/640MS.png) Virizion
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/d/df/003MS.png) Venusaur
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/7/78/233MS.png) Porygon2
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/13/641MS.png) Tornadus

The OU Tier allows anything in the below tiers, it bans anything Uber.

The OU Tier also bans from it's metagame something that is explained in this specific rule:

The Drizzle+Swift Swim Combination
The Pokémon Politoad gets the ability Drizzle which summons infinite Rain weather.  Some other Pokémon get the abilty Swift Swim which doubles their speed in Rain.  The combination of using a Pokémon with Drizzle and Swift Swim on the same team is banned.


Title: The Uber Tier
Post by: Scarlet Spider on June 10, 2011, 09:33:57 am
Uber Tier

(http://oi54.tinypic.com/2ur9xc0.jpg)

The Uber Tier is the tier above OU in that all Pokémon in this tier are banned from use in OU for being too powerful.  Uber Tier is its own metagame too where everything is allowed except for the things banned in the Clauses.

The List Currently Includes:

(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/9/94/493MS.png)Arceus
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/3/3e/257MS.png)Blaziken
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/a/a7/491MS.png)Darkrai
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/07/386AMS.png)Deoxys (Attack Forme)
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/86/386MS.png)Deoxys (Normal Forme)
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/c/ca/483MS.png)Dialga
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/6/63/445MS.png) Garchomp
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/e8/487MS.png)Giratina
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/2/2f/487OMS.png)Giratina (Origin Forme)
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/bc/383MS.png)Groudon
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/ee/250MS.png)Ho-Oh
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/11/382MS.png)Kyogre
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/c/c8/249MS.png)Lugia
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/01/490MS.png)Manaphy
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/1a/150MS.png)Mewtwo
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/2/24/484MS.png)Palkia
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/9/90/384MS.png)Rayquaza
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/03/643MS.png)Reshiram
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/6/68/492SMS.png)Shaymin (Sky Forme)
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/b2/644MS.png)Zekrom


Title: The UU Tier and BL Tier
Post by: Scarlet Spider on June 10, 2011, 09:58:04 am
UU Tier

(http://oi55.tinypic.com/103ylol.jpg)

The UU Tier (UnderUsed) is the metagame created that bans all the Pokémon used enough to be OU, thus allowing the next bunch of Pokémon to be used in their own metagame where the overused ones are banned.  It is determined by usage itself too, allowing UU Pokémon to be banned from the next usage tier and so forth.

The List Currently Includes:

(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/0c/494MS.png)Victini
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/ed/237MS.png)Hitmontop
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/3/35/059MS.png)Arcanine
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/2/2c/232MS.png)Donphan
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/ea/113MS.png)Chansey
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/4/4c/214MS.png)Heracross
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/3/3f/145MS.png)Zapdos
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/18/034MS.png)Nidoking
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/85/037MS.png)Vulpix
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/a/a7/151MS.png)Mew
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/eb/330MS.png)Flygon
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/b6/080MS.png)Slowbro
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/ff/395MS.png)Empoleon
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/5a/350MS.png)Milotic
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/6/64/586MS.png)Sawsbuck
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/fc/460MS.png)Abomasnow
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/ea/245MS.png)Suicune
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/2/20/386DMS.png)Deoxys-D
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/8e/230MS.png)Kingdra
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/fe/407MS.png)Roserade
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/01/482MS.png)Azelf
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/3/36/638MS.png)Cobalion
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/5a/251MS.png)Celebi
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/4/47/429MS.png)Mismagius
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/12/473MS.png)Mamoswine
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/2/2e/379MS.png)Registeel
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/d/d6/143MS.png)Snorlax
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/0e/589MS.png)Escavalier
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/9/96/461MS.png)Weavile
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/3/31/031MS.png)Nidoqueen
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/6/6b/229MS.png)Houndoom
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/c/cd/356MS.png)Dusclops
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/8f/478MS.png)Froslass
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/3/3e/625MS.png)Bisharp
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/7/76/561MS.png)Sigilyph
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/12/178MS.png)Xatu
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/16/135MS.png)Jolteon
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/6/63/468MS.png)Togekiss
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/5b/424MS.png)Ambipom
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/e0/442MS.png)Spiritomb
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/9/9b/071MS.png)Victreebel
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/a/a6/492MS.png)Shaymin
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/a/aa/465MS.png)Tangrowth
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/89/184MS.png)Azumarill
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/01/006MS.png)Charizard
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/87/479OMS.png)Rotom-H
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/bd/571MS.png)Zoroark
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/58/449MS.png)Hippopotas
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/80/243MS.png)Raikou
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/9/96/169MS.png)Crobat
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/d/d1/142MS.png)Aerodactyl

The UU Tier allows anything in the below tiers, it bans anything Uber, OU or BL.

The UU Tier also bans from it's metagame something that is explained in this specific rule:

The Drought Ban
Drought is allowed in the highter tiers, but from the UU tier AND the lower Tiers, Drought is banned.  Drought is an ability that summons infinite Sun to the field.  It is banned from UU and below tiers, but allowed in higher tiers.


BL Tier

(http://oi55.tinypic.com/2vbna0h.jpg)

The BorderLine Tier is a tier based on power and it bans the Pokémon too powerful in the UU Tier, so it will then send them up into this higher tier, BL.  BL Pokémon can be used in the OU and Uber Metagames, but not in the lower Metagames.  However BL is not a Metagame of its own since it would just be UU except with the few overpowered things let back in.

The List Currently Includes:

(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/12/646MS.png) Kyurem
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/a/a7/196MS.png) Espeon
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/5f/398MS.png) Staraptor
(http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/fa/202MS.png) Wobbuffet


Title: Re: Pokémon Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on June 10, 2011, 09:58:19 am
reserved for RU tier stuff

(http://oi51.tinypic.com/141igeu.jpg)


Title: Re: Pokémon Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on June 10, 2011, 09:58:28 am
reserved for NU Tier stuff


Title: Re: Pokémon Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on June 10, 2011, 09:58:42 am
reserved for Little Cup Pokémon and Banlist

(http://oi56.tinypic.com/vb0gi.jpg)


Title: Re: Pokémon Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on June 10, 2011, 09:59:02 am
reserved just in case anything else.

Please don't post anyone :) thank you


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on June 10, 2011, 04:17:16 pm
boss neon added some pictures to make things look nicer.. it's just a couple of the dream world arts for the mons.. don't have one for NU yet since RU's stats havn't been compiled yet.


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Teenage Mutant Ninja Squirtles on August 25, 2011, 04:45:07 pm
Why is Vulpix UU? Isn't the ability 'Drought' banned from UU and below so what use could Vulpix possibly have?


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on August 25, 2011, 05:00:17 pm
Why is Vulpix UU? Isn't the ability 'Drought' banned from UU and below so what use could Vulpix possibly have?
Vulpix was put in the UU list before Drought got banned.  Next time the Tiers change, Vulpix will most likely drop down into the murky depths of unemployment.


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: JCBellsprout on August 25, 2011, 06:18:07 pm
Vulpix was put in the UU list before Drought got banned.  Next time the Tiers change, Vulpix will most likely drop down into the murky depths of unemployment.

Vulpix itself wasn't banned in UU, just the ability itself, which means one could use a non DW Vulpix, although why even bother xD

Also I've been hearing talk of Staraptor being banned, but I don't see anything about it.


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on August 26, 2011, 04:09:23 am
Vulpix itself wasn't banned in UU, just the ability itself, which means one could use a non DW Vulpix, although why even bother xD
Well yeah I know that, otherwise I wouldnt have said it would drop down.

Also I've been hearing talk of Staraptor being banned, but I don't see anything about it.
Staraptor is banned, along with Espeon and Wobb (and not Chansey >.< ).


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: JCBellsprout on August 26, 2011, 12:10:03 pm
I've actually tried Staraptor in UU a few times beforehand, it was truly amazing in brute force.

Are they now in BL or UU?

Also no Chansey?  :D


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on August 26, 2011, 02:10:55 pm
I've actually tried Staraptor in UU a few times beforehand, it was truly amazing in brute force.

Are they now in BL or UU?

Also no Chansey?  :D
Staraptor is BL, like I said before it's banned from UU thus it's BL because it was broken and everyone used one

Chansey is still UU because it didnt get a super majority, it's only got a simple majority so it's a suspect next round.  Why it's not banned already is beyond me, again it's broken and everyone uses one.


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: JCBellsprout on August 26, 2011, 02:19:39 pm
Staraptor is BL, like I said before it's banned from UU thus it's BL because it was broken and everyone used one

Chansey is still UU because it didnt get a super majority, it's only got a simple majority so it's a suspect next round.  Why it's not banned already is beyond me, again it's broken and everyone uses one.

Meant to say OU earlier, but yea I completely agree especially on Chansey.


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: JCBellsprout on August 30, 2011, 12:46:42 am
Hey Aryeh, could you make it so the names of the pokemon link back to their new pages?


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Teenage Mutant Ninja Squirtles on September 02, 2011, 06:15:22 pm
Where's Dusknoir? I can see Dusklops but isn't Dusknoir better?


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: JCBellsprout on September 02, 2011, 06:20:51 pm
Where's Dusknoir? I can see Dusklops but isn't Dusknoir better?

With Eviolite Dusclops outdoing what Dusknoir can do in walling potential, Dusknoir has dropped to NU.


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Teenage Mutant Ninja Squirtles on September 02, 2011, 07:06:09 pm
With Eviolite Dusclops outdoing what Dusknoir can do in walling potential, Dusknoir has dropped to NU.
I forgot that item *face palm*
I also have a great rain dance team in mind (how original >_<). It involves a Politoad lol :)
I think its better then most. I'm not going to post everything because that will take too long but here are the pokemon:
Politoad (defensive), Toxicroak, Thunderus, Ferroforn, Latios/Latias (I'm thinking Latias as it takes more hits). My last pokemon is between, Ludiciolo (makes the most of rain dance and if or when Politoad goes down, Ludicolo can keep the rain dance and it makes the most of it while rain dance is there), Virizton (just a solid sweeper that can take a hit and it loses its fire weekness) or azumaril (aqua jet, STAB and in rain will take care of most pokemon). There is one more pokemon but I doubt it will be a viable option. Swampert. Its a strong pokemon, does well in the rain but I think Azumaril will be the better option.


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on September 03, 2011, 04:01:24 am
I forgot that item *face palm*
I also have a great rain dance team in mind (how original >_<). It involves a Politoad lol :)
I think its better then most. I'm not going to post everything because that will take too long but here are the pokemon:
Politoad (defensive), Toxicroak, Thunderus, Ferroforn, Latios/Latias (I'm thinking Latias as it takes more hits). My last pokemon is between, Ludiciolo (makes the most of rain dance and if or when Politoad goes down, Ludicolo can keep the rain dance and it makes the most of it while rain dance is there), Virizton (just a solid sweeper that can take a hit and it loses its fire weekness) or azumaril (aqua jet, STAB and in rain will take care of most pokemon). There is one more pokemon but I doubt it will be a viable option. Swampert. Its a strong pokemon, does well in the rain but I think Azumaril will be the better option.
don't bother with swampert, it's basically the 4thgenelectivire of this gen, aka the one that makes it to ou despite being subpar and outclassed by things.
Thundurus is a suspect, it might be banned..
but yeah politoad/ferrothorn/virizion/latios/toxicroak/azumarill is a solid team, but if thundurus doesnt get banned it could be put in..


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Teenage Mutant Ninja Squirtles on September 03, 2011, 05:48:13 am
If it is put into uber, I think Zapdos will still be a viable option. I'll probably be replacing Virizton with it though.


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on September 03, 2011, 11:58:58 am
If it is put into uber, I think Zapdos will still be a viable option. I'll probably be replacing Virizton with it though.
Virizion is more worth it tbh
Zapdos and Thundurus play different roles despite having the same type, it's not just about typing, it's about strategy and they play differently.


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Teenage Mutant Ninja Squirtles on September 03, 2011, 02:46:41 pm
What I have realised with my team is that if Latios faints, appart from Politoad, I will have no other pokemon on my team that is special orientated.


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on September 04, 2011, 05:21:59 am
What I have realised with my team is that if Latios faints, appart from Politoad, I will have no other pokemon on my team that is special orientated.
This is OU, OU has been a Physical Metagame since Gen 1


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Cypheric on September 14, 2011, 06:14:33 am
Evasion clause doesn't have to be specific, there are more moves, I believe, that raise evasion and lower accuracy, along with abilities.


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on September 14, 2011, 09:53:10 am
Evasion clause doesn't have to be specific, there are more moves, I believe, that raise evasion and lower accuracy, along with abilities.
Accuracy Lowering Moves are not part of Evasion Clause because a Pokémon can switch out when their accuracy is lowered, but can't when their opponent's evasion is higher.  Abilities are not part of Evasion Clause, Moody has its own clause, so currently Evasion Clause is the two moves and two items, listing what they are helps those reading this thread know which ones are covered by the clause so yes it does have to be specific :P


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Cypheric on September 14, 2011, 02:58:58 pm
Accuracy Lowering Moves are not part of Evasion Clause because a Pokémon can switch out when their accuracy is lowered, but can't when their opponent's evasion is higher.  Abilities are not part of Evasion Clause, Moody has its own clause, so currently Evasion Clause is the two moves and two items, listing what they are helps those reading this thread know which ones are covered by the clause so yes it does have to be specific :P

What about abilities such as Sand Veil?

EDIT: Also, I don't see much point in the Status Clause, due to the fact many teams are meant to spread status.

You just ruined my Mandibuzz. :p


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: JCBellsprout on September 14, 2011, 03:31:06 pm
What about abilities such as Sand Veil?

EDIT: Also, I don't see much point in the Status Clause, due to the fact many teams are meant to spread status.

You just ruined my Mandibuzz. :p

Sand Veil/Snow Cloak are allowed, only using Evasion increasing items along with it (like Brightpowder) isn't allowed. Anyway the most versatile user, Garchomp, was already banned.

Status Clause isn't used much, it's on the non-standard list. 


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on September 14, 2011, 03:56:37 pm
What about abilities such as Sand Veil?

EDIT: Also, I don't see much point in the Status Clause, due to the fact many teams are meant to spread status.

You just ruined my Mandibuzz. :p
Status Clause isnt standard, I've put it on there for completion's sake
Sand Veil and Snow Cloak are not part of the evasion clause despite some people having tried to make it so


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on September 19, 2011, 12:57:40 pm
The tiers are likely going to change soon so when that happens, I'm going to update this topic with links to the smogon pages for them once both the tiers have changed and RU tier mons are established due to NU being made.

However I'm about to put the links for a couple of mons just to see how it shows up on the page nicely

they will be Ferrothorn, Tyranitar, Scizor and Latios


Title: Re: Smogon's 5th Generation Tier List for Competitive Battling + Standard Rules
Post by: Scarlet Spider on October 07, 2011, 11:05:01 am
I will update this some time after Round 5 OU finishes, in the mean time here is a copypasta of the tiers:

Quote
Uber:

Mewtwo
Lugia
Ho-Oh
Blaziken
Kyogre
Groudon
Rayquaza
Deoxys
Garchomp
Dialga
Palkia
Giratina
Manaphy
Darkrai
Arceus
Deoxys-A
Shaymin-S
Giratina-O
Reshiram
Zekrom

OU:

Venusaur
Ninetales
Tentacruel
Cloyster
Gengar
Starmie
Gyarados
Vaporeon
Dragonite
Politoed
Espeon
Forretress
Scizor
Skarmory
Blissey
Tyranitar
Celebi
Swampert
Breloom
Salamence
Metagross
Latias
Latios
Jirachi
Infernape
Gastrodon
Bronzong
Lucario
Toxicroak
Magnezone
Gliscor
Heatran
Rotom-W
Deoxys-S
Excadrill
Conkeldurr
Scrafty
Reuniclus
Jellicent
Ferrothorn
Haxorus
Mienshao
Hydreigon
Volcarona
Terrakion
Virizion
Thundurus
Landorus

BL:

Wobbuffet
Staraptor
Kyurem

UU:

Blastoise
Nidoqueen
Nidoking
Arcanine
Machamp
Slowbro
Chansey
Jolteon
Aerodactyl
Snorlax
Zapdos
Mew
Crobat
Xatu
Azumarill
Umbreon
Heracross
Houndoom
Kingdra
Donphan
Porygon2
Hitmontop
Raikou
Suicune
Flygon
Milotic
Dusclops
Registeel
Empoleon
Roserade
Ambipom
Mismagius
Spiritomb
Hippopotas
Hippowdon
Abomasnow
Weavile
Rhyperior
Togekiss
Mamoswine
Froslass
Azelf
Cresselia
Shaymin
Rotom-H
Deoxys-D
Victini
Stoutland
Whimsicott
Darmanitan
Sigilyph
Zoroark
Escavalier
Chandelure
Golurk
Bisharp
Cobalion
Tornadus

BL2:
Yanmega
Venomoth

RU:

Charizard
Sandslash
Clefable
Primeape
Alakazam
Victreebel
Hitmonlee
Hitmonchan
Scyther
Omastar
Kabutops
Moltres
Typhlosion
Feraligatr
Gligar
Steelix
Qwilfish
Entei
Sceptile
Ludicolo
Hariyama
Aggron
Medicham
Manectric
Sharpedo
Crawdaunt
Claydol
Honchkrow
Munchlax
Drapion
Tangrowth
Electivire
Porygon-Z
Gallade
Dusknoir
Rotom
Uxie
Rotom-C
Lilligant
Krookodile
Crustle
Cofagrigus
Archeops
Sawsbuck
Galvantula
Ferroseed
Accelgor
Bouffalant
Mandibuzz
Durant